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Fri Apr 20, 2018 16:41:51 ISTHomeTrainsΣChainsAtlasPNRForumGalleryNewsFAQTripsLoginFeedback

Blog Entry# 3195729
Posted: Mar 12 2018 (10:08)

4 Responses
Last Response: Mar 13 2018 (08:42)
16 votes
Mar 12 2018 (10:08)   GZB/WAG-12

Avishek Ray~   415 blog posts   7 correct pred (78% accurate)
Entry# 3195729            Tags   Past Edits
#TheCritic (Moto of these polls is to discuss different facts)
Since the news came out about a new 12000HP Alstom loco, we all were curious about it. But finally when the footage of 'WAG12' wad revealed, what it appeared is that it is only two 6000HP locos stitched together.
So do you think that it is overhyped, misleading and kind of a lie?
1) Yes. it's twin loco tech only which is already common in IR0%0
2) Yes. a single loco is actually less powerful than WAG90%0
3) Yes. existing WAG9 could easily be modified and a WAG9 twin could produce 12700HP. which is greater than WAG120%0
4) All of the above38%6
5) No. it is actually a progress in technogy63%10
6) Any other opinion (Please comment)0%0
7) No idea0%0

Mar 12 2018 (11:14)
Offline till SSC CGL 2018 tier 1~   508 blog posts   1708 correct pred (70% accurate)
Re# 3195729-1            Tags   Past Edits
Yes it is overhyped. Attaching 3 locos of 4000 hp will give similar power of around 12000 hp, so nothing new in it. Had it been a single loco delivering 12000 hp then it would hav been a different thing.

Mar 12 2018 (13:21)
HOG WAM4 WAP1~   3687 blog posts
Re# 3195729-2            Tags   Past Edits
Sorry for the rather long post.
I can't comment about the 'over-hyped' part. But it is not 'misleading', and neither is it a 'lie'. Going by the options you have given -
1) No. It is not just simply 2 locos MU'ed together. It is a 'twin section' locomotive. The two units together make up a single locomotive. Making a locomotive more powerful requires it to be bigger and heavier. And beyond a certain limit, having the entire locomotive in a single unit may not
be the ideal design. A WAG9 already has an axle load of 20.5 tonnes and is more than 20.5 meters long. Bumping up the power to 12000HP, would require a substantial increase in axle load, if only 6 axles are used. And it can also make the locomotive longer. When the locomotive, or for that matter, even a freight wagon becomes longer in length, its speed potential on curves decreases. Designing the locomotive as 2 units gives more design flexibility and allows the designers to optimize a whole lot of other parameters. They can get more room for the driver cabins, get better ventilation for the components, make it more power efficient.
A MU'ed WAG7, or a MU'ed WAG9 has more hauling capacity than a single loco, but there is no other improvement. A MU'ed WAG9 is not a 'better' loco than a single WAG9. It has the same efficiency, the same MPS, the same power ratings. Its essentially using up double the space and double the power of a single WAG9 but does NOT provide any advantages or improvements over single loco. Its not the same case with the WAG12. Though it's built as 2 units. Right from the design stage itself, the space in the 2 units is utilized optimally to provide advantages in all aspects. So, no. It is not 'twin loco tech only' and its not common in IR.
2) Same as the above mentioned points. Talking about a single unit of the WAG12 locomotive is like talking about half of a WAG9 loco, or one bogie (out of the two) in a WAG9 loco. The two sections make up the complete loco. Also, each section of the locomotive is more powerful than a WAG9. Total locomotive HP is not the only measure of power. A WAG9 has 6350HP spread over 6 axles, roughly 1050HP per axle. In WAG12, each section is 6000HP on 4 axles, roughly 1500HP per axle - more than 50% as powerful as the WAG9.
3) For the same points mentioned above, twin WAG9's won't be any improvement. Each locomotive in a twin-WAG9 consist is still a normal WAG9 loco with the same drawbacks and performance limits. The WAG12 will still be able to haul a load at a higher speed for the same power consumption for the reasons mentioned above (1500HP per axle in the WAG12 vs 1050HP per axle in the WAG9). If that has to be matched, then each WAG9 will have to be 9000HP. This will be much heavier than the single unit of the WAG12, while still having the same power per axle. So it will be able to haul loads at the same MPS but will consume much more power.
This is the same reason why the WAP7 can never be a high speed locomotive , but the WAP5, with lesser HP is capable of high speed runs. The WAP5 only has to split its power among 4 axles, while the WAP7 has to split it among 6 axles. So the WAP5 gets to use higher rated traction motors, making it capable of higher speeds. And just compare the dimensions of the locomotive. The WAP7 with 6350HP weighs 123 tonnes, and is more than 20m long, but the WAP5, capable of a maximum of 6000HP (continuous 5440HP) weighs only 78 tonnes and is about 18m long. And the WAP5 is still capable of hauling 26 coach ICF rakes at 110kmph.

There are many possible wheel configurations and power system architectures possible in locomotive designs. All of these advantages cannot be obtained using a single design for all purposes. This is the same reason why we designed a WAG7 when 2 WAG5's could do the same work. Or why we designed a WAG9 when 2 WAG7's or 3 WAG5's could achieve a similar performance. Simply drawing a heavy load is not the only performance metric to be looked for. They are many more things that have to be monitored or optimized when designing a locomotive. Don't go by face value.

Mar 12 2018 (15:49)
Every person who works hard is a HERO^~   90096 blog posts   5332 correct pred (78% accurate)
Re# 3195729-3            Tags   Past Edits
Sirf IRI me overhyped hua.... Baaki jagh to normal tha

Mar 13 2018 (08:42)
Avishek Ray~   415 blog posts   7 correct pred (78% accurate)
Re# 3195729-4            Tags   Past Edits
Haan yeh sahi hain ke we railfans were over excited, lekin news mein bhi aaya tha.

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